We are having a Loot/Attendance/Expansion discussion in Core on our forums. Graytail made a very good point today:
We are a casual guild with a population including some leaning more towards serious raiding–which is great for synergy.ย At some point however, conversations on this thread make it sound like we are moving away from being a casual guild–correct me if I am wrong.ย I /agree with Janick’s previous comments of don’t equate a non 100% attendance rate as a lack of dedication to the guild or its players.
I replied with the following:ย
I agree with Gray on this point. As I don’t know most of you, but taking a look at online time and posts, I would venture a guess that most of Core would want to raid every night of the week, but not get in trouble on the off-chance that something came up in RL.
The question is: Is that ‘casual,’ or a ‘hardcore, forgiving’ guild? What is the definition of ‘casual’ in the sense of a guild with BWL raiding capabilities? Obviously, there needs to be some sense of direction for those that want to progress through the instances, but is thatthe direction of the guild as a whole?
IMHO, there are 2 things that will allow a hardcore group to tout themselves as casual:
1: No punishments for not showing up (DKP or razzing). RL happens, and I’ve heard that is what a lot of you hated about Method.
2: If a truly casual player finally gets keyed for an instance, or that lonely rogue who has been soloing is still wearing a hat from level 45, but wants to go to MC, let them in. There are enough hardcore players to make up the difference.
You all have been pretty friendly, and I think that makes for a lot of a guild’s happiness and cohesiveness, so we can add that to the list of things Core has going for it.
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Are there any other ideas out there about what a casual guild is all about when it consists of hardcore, raiding players?
Well, I think a key thing is to make sure that in-game goals don’t come first. What I mean is that the people in the guild are more important than loot. As long as people are more important than the raid, then you’re doing fine. However if the raid becomes more important than the people who comprise it, then I don’t think you can keep the ‘casual’ tag.
I certainly think that those who want to raid all the time should be able to do so, but at the same time you shouldn’t look down those who don’t. That being said if you’re casually raiding, make sure you set up your DKP to allow people who only raid occasionally to still get loot. If you’re rewarding those who raid the most, then you’re basically pressuring others to raid more to keep parity. That IMHO is not casual.
My guild, while certainly not at the same level as yours, works of a 1 blue, 1 purple, 1 class piece per raid. Someone who’s never missed a raid and someone on their first one have the same odds of getting a specific piece. Obviously the regular raider will get more stuff just because he’s raiding more, but I think giving him an even better shot through your DKP is anti-casual.
I guess what I’m saying is that casual guilds don’t penalize (intentionally or inadvertently) those who play less. A ‘hardcore’ guild rewards those who play the most, thus in a sense penalizing those that don’t.
Interesting system…I like it. Last evening, Josh/Aeigelus/”GM” posted pretty much the same answer. He is making a distinction between raiding and loot. If it becomes about the loot, we are not casual. If it is about the raid, then it must still be about the people.