So there I was – back at work after a 5-day weekend and surfing my guild’s officer forums. Typical stuff mostly, monthly promotions, new applicants to mull over, conflicts with the raid schedule, pie or cake – blah, blah, blah. One thread caught my attention though and it had to do with the guild’s druid-folk and loot priorities. Feeling like I had bear in that race I dug in.
Seems the guild master decided to post some rules on druids and what they could roll on in Kara’. A good thing – since lootz = dramaz and druids are all about the drama.
Here’s what the decision looked like:
- Tank Feral Druids have priority on Leather Drops that are tanking specific
- DoomChicken Druids have priority on Leather Drops that are caster specific
- Resto Druids have priority on Leather Drops that are healzor specific
- DPS Druids CAN NOT roll on DPS Leather – Rogues only
[Cut to Guild’s Druid Class Officer]
<Go Cat Form!>
/target Guild Master
/mangle /mangle /mangle /mangle
After about 10k of damage and a lot of forums screaming – one of our tanking druids went bear form and sat on the class officer. She immediately calmed down enough for us to call in a medic. Moments later one of our resto brethren tossed off some heal-dotz and after a few minutes, both had calmed or coagulated enough to carry on a reasonable conversation….
Still spitting and snarling through bits of the GM’s robe, the class officer pointed out the following:
A feral druid brings utility to the raid that is more than just dps. Innervate for a caster, battle rez for anyone, group healing through improved leader of the pack, increased damage from bleeds with mangle, etc. Not to mention off-healing, cleansing, and buffz. Long story short – don’t neglect druid loot because druids bring diversity and flexibility to the raid – something rogues can’t do.
Then the rogue class-leader came along….He obviously felt that the GM’s decision was both wise and just.
As far as he was concerned, druids had three roles there were going to be relegated to in the guild:
- Healer
- Tank
- Caster DPS
And that was it. The bears could tank and tank well – the healers could tree it up and cast happy-dotz all they wanted – and the Boomkin were given free reign to nuke and nuke and nuke and nuke. But the catz? No – it’s nice they can dps and all, but the catz need to pick a different spec. Leave the damage dealing to the adults.
The difference in their arguments came from the stances each class officer had taken – both were as timeless as the classes themselves.
- Druid: We are versatile – Gear us with versatility in mind
- Rogue: We only have so many drops – don’t let other classes ninja them – there are other ways to gear druids or warriors to dps that don’t include giving them dibs on our leather Kara loot
A lot of this seems to come down to the fact that the work Blizzard has done to allow hybridization and to improve the itemization of gear to support it, are still hit and miss. For the druid class, the problem seems to be one of too many options. They can *do* almost anything – but the fact leads many to view the class as greedy and overreaching. For the rogues comes the problem of specialization – what can they really do other than put out damage, manage aggro well and provide some limited CC? With such seemingly limited versatility, allowing them members-only access to dps leather can be viewed as greedy and unfair.
Which would you prefer in your raid? Do you go for hybrids and versatility or do you prefer to maintain specialist characters for specialist slots?
In a number of guilds on the same progression level (through Gruul) I am starting to see a great deal of acceptance and preference for characters that bring options to the raid leader. DPS slots that have traditionally gone to rogues or hunters are now being parceled out to appropriately specced Shaman and Druids. Does this break down as you try to extend into deeper content or are single function classes like rogue and mage becoming obsolete while the hybrids take over?
Drop us a line and let us know how your guild handles things.
Interesting. Well, to be honest our raid make-up has a feral druid OT, and me, a healing druid. We have a rogue and on a great night a balance druid will occasionally stop in to fill a spot. Obviously and leather gear for healers goes to me, all caster leather goes to the boomkin, and all dps leather is rolled between the rogue and the druid OT in our raids. This is because other than about 4-5 bosses in Kara, our druid OT is in cat form busting out some uber dps. I’m the guild leader of my guild, and I think that we need both to be just as geared as everyone else, even if it means giving the druid 2 sets of gear. One note tho: Most gear in kara for feral druid is obvious – it’s either T4 or things like the staff from illhoof. I think they should have a chance to roll, just as the rogues do.
This narks me off a little too..
As a retribution paladin the key items we need when it comes to loot have to have Strength, Agi, and Stam, and to a lesser extent Int.
What do “druid” items look like?
Strength, agi, and stam, and sometimes int!
So I start bidding dkp on something in SSC a couple weeks ago and i get told that i wasnt allowed, and that this was druid loot get your filthly paladin mits off….. So instead of getting something that will improove my dps, i am forced to give it up so that the druid tank can use it for pvp!
I was furious!! But i bit my lip and said nothing. I now have to wait for it to drop again from Lurker and hope that a druid doesnt want it.
Grrrr!!
I feel your pain brother i feel your pain!
/feeling the pain, as well. This seemed to always happen to Gitr in MC and was one part of the big fallout on Kargath back in the day. He’s a fury warrior and was constantly battling the rogues and hunters for weapons, even though the armor was clearly differentiated between the three classes.
You also have to take into consideration that TO this day… Rogues pump out the most dps over any other class with exception to REALLY well geared shadow priests and fury warriors (ONLY when the boss doesnt have to be tanked), otherwise fury warriors CANNOT go all out… Rogues when geared properly and specced right can be found to be the top dps CONSTANTLY. Yes, they can only deal damage… Yes they dont heal, or res, or tank (with exception to a good rogue evasion tanking on a bad pull). However, consistant 600+ dps with minor kara gear, or consistant 800+ dps with kara gear on SSC/Eye bosses… Makes rogues priceless to gear up. Higher raid dps = bosses down. Bosses down > ressing people > off-tanking. If everyone knows what they are doing… there shouldn’t be the NEED for battle rez. Or backup healing. Or cc. Want good feral dps gear? Turn to crafting, arena gear, pvp gear… It is MADE for you… Str, Stam, Agi.
You make a good point, Bloodranch. Thanks for stopping by.
I have yet to delve into PvP for gear, but I assure you, it’s coming very soon. I have turned to crafting, though. As a tailor outfitting Deadr with Shadowweave gear and a blacksmith suiting Paladr up with blue leggings yesterday, I am enjoying the benefits you mentioned.
65 feral druid
I prefer DPSing although i can agree with you that there is better gear that is crafted or the arena/pvp staffs E.g the gladiator 2h mace which give 700+ ap is 1 of the best feral druid weps i have seen pre kara. But there will be time when you have to roll on so called “Rogue” gear because frankly it’s if it’s better than what you have atm and it has the right stats you should be able to roll on it, but in most instances there’s only gear that give Agi + Sta and that is rogue gear and u should give him/her priority inless it’s alot better than the piece of gear u have.
That is my view on it.
As a previous raid leader, and a starting feral druid, I can see both sides of this argument, to a point. A rogues gear table in Karazhan is quite specific, and although a druid can use these items for an upgrade to his feral, and possibly, tanking sets, now that kara drops badges of justice, both classes have better gear to recieve that way, for the most part. Some of the gear in kara that may have been considered strictly rogue gear has been re-worked with such things as expertise and now should also be considered for our fabulous kitty’s as well. In truth, a ten man raid party really only has room for 1 or 2 rogues tops! While druids can of course fill these roles as well as the role of caster, OT, and healer, rogues are very specific in what they can or cannot do. In my honest opinion, and based upon the assumption that you run with the same, or close to the same, ten man group in kara, I would say that , where dps leather is concerned, it should go on a individual basis as to whom the item is the bigger upgrade for, as well as (and this is if you have honesty among the ten) who is closest to having a better item from badges.
I think gear should be rewarded to who the guild leaders think deserves it most.. That’s a personal opinion and a way that my endgame guild in Final Fantasy XI ran.
I like the method I used(along with many others,) and would attempt to use it in WoW, also.
Everyone joins with 0 points.
You earn points depending on which events you attend, and how often, you earn points.
If you help guildies, you earn points, depending on how much you helped, etc.
Points are decided by how much the leaders think the assistances/attendances are worth.
Then for each item that drops off each instance is applied a point value, which is shown to the whole guild via forums, of course.
When it drops, people that want it, need to have points, and then out of those people that have the points and want it, the leaders talk quick and decide who gets it.
IMO, that’s the *BEST* way to go awarding people, because then there is no drama, and if there is drama it breaks down to a “This leader is playing favorites!” Which is why there are numerous leaders, so it’s not a ‘favorites’ game.
Through my experience, not only does this make the guild drama-less(when it comes to drops,) but also, it helps the guild in it’s entirety. You’d be suprised how many people will help when they usually wouldn’t until item drops are involved. ๐
70 Feral druid
Hmm this is a little new to me.I have been argueing with my warrior friend for the longest time and he said that i should only expect to tank in raids period(Gruul dps WTF?!) lol and if i even get to dps it wouldent go past kara O.o… anywayz i think the best way to distribute th dops would be to give it to who ever as the lessser gear or whoever has got already won something during the run.No drama, no excuses, no complaints :]
gotta say, as a person who has spent my time on wow jumping back and forth between druid and rogue – this is a tricky subject.
Dont get me wrong, I feel for the rogues, gear is hard to come by. At the same time though, my druid is on his toes the entire run. healer falling behind- get the druid to tranq. death- druid gets to rebirth. poisons or curses- druid cleanses/abolish. need extra bleed damage- druid mangles. need meat sheild- ya got yer druid. =)
Does a group need a druid to be successful? No. But they do provide a cushion in case other players are less then perfect.
On one hand, you’ve got the rogue that could despretly use the gear.
Rogue’s great dps job requires that gear .. and therefore he deserves it.
On the other, you’ve got the druid that’s been working his ass off to provide decent dps and whatever else is needed by the group.
A druid’s job is to keep other classes jobs bearable, and if he does that, he also deserves a shot at roll.
I love me some rogues, but c’mon now, a hardworking druid needs love too.